VN Ren'Py Our Red String [Ch.13.3.3] [Eva Kiss]

dontcarewhateverno said:

"Bro. She must be cheating on him with Steve. He's messed around with Lisa and get this... she says he's got a girlfriend. Case proven, motherfucker!"

Real life, in a group of 13 friends/aquaintances:
'Dude. Wtf are you talking about? You realize the world consists of more than just our 13 person friend-group?'
"Yeah. Uh.. Sorry Bro. Just high."

ORS or average sitcom doing fan-service:
'Checks out, bro. Tha's craazy!!'
"I kno rite?!?"

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I mean heres the thing. ORS is written very much like a sitcom

So yeah I mean in real life theres more fish in the sea

Having said that dude small towns act like this. I know people who only date from a group of like 20 people they went to school with.

It is weird but thats small town for ya

jackypetersy89 said:

I mean heres the thing. ORS is written very much like a sitcom

So yeah I mean in real life theres more fish in the sea

Having said that dude small towns act like this. I know people who only date from a group of like 20 people they went to school with.

It is weird but thats small town for ya

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It was never established how small of a town this is actually, but if I have to guess, it's bigger than most of the towns where I live. They got a huge club, a huge mall, fine dining restaurants and luxury hotels and so on. Never have I encountered such a coincidence rich and deluded situations where I live and the biggest town we got is less than 500K.

jackypetersy89 said:

I mean heres the thing. ORS is written very much like a sitcom

So yeah I mean in real life theres more fish in the sea

Having said that dude small towns act like this. I know people who only date from a group of like 20 people they went to school with.

It is weird but thats small town for ya

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True. But (+ I've made the same point before) in a town small enough to have so many crazy coincidences in a 6 month span, every single one of these characters would have met each other already, unlike in ORS where several friend-groups are meeting for the first time in this timeline. (Plus, as MF points out, that's a lot of businesses to support in a small town, even if they're struggling rn).

It really chalks up to suspension of disbelief, which some players/viewers/readers find easier to swallow than others. Viewers with a strong suspension of disbelief: "Gillian/Mike FUCK YEA!!" or "Dude. What if Rachel dated Chandler next?!? That would be crazy!!"

INB4: 'But why?' "Cuz red string". 'Ok. Cool. Checks out, man. Can't argue with that storytelling logic. .'

For me, Baluart reminds me of any typical capital city of a spanish province, like Valencia. Medium in population , with a university atmosphere, relatively well connected. Not as big as Madrid or Barcelona, but big enough to have significant wealth and industry, as well as a well-known local oligarchy.

Being EK spanish I suppose that it will have been based on this type of cities.

JoeSte91 said:

Realistically, Holly can be in a relationship, having sex and still be concerned that she's not enough for Ian, given that he's suggested to be more experienced than her, and depending on the player choices, literally hanging out with 3-4 models weekly. I personally just find it a bit of a stretch that she supposedly comfortable in that situation, and I think her dialogue as well reflects a continued doubt of her self-worth that Ivy and Slut Lena could prey upon. As one optional path for her character. I like to play the pure route too.

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Interesting. "My boyfriend is so good and he's hanging out with different hot girls all the time that I feel inferior to. What should I do? Maybe dress in a different way? Try something new in bed? Try watching some porn to get new ideas to spice it up? Have more romantic dates to make him see that I'll never hurt him? No, cheating sounds like the best option. Once I'm slutty and experienced enough, no way he'll look at other girls!"

I'm not really an expert in psychology, and while technically there have been cases like these, in order for that to be possible, Holly's insecurity would need to be way stronger than her love for Ian. Because cheating on your boyfriend, who is still struggling after his last heartbreak, seems like a sure way to end that relationship in the dumbest way possible. Even if she may feel insecure intimately, I believe she doesn't think that cheating is something a loving girlfriend should do. And Holly may be gullible, but she's not stupid and can see several steps ahead. After all, she orchestrated the whole "Oh no, my room has only one bed so we'll have to sleep together" move. And on top of it, she's an avid reader. I imagine she read countless romance stories (good ones) and knows the most common relationship-ending factors like cheating, jealousy, lack of communication, etc.

If anything, if she's indeed this insecure, I think it would make her open to share Ian with other girls instead so he'd feel sexually satisfied with them and emotionally satisfied with her. You can already see this in the way she treats her relationship with Lena. When she learns about Louise or Ivy being side-hoes, she doesn't feel jealous (inferior to Ivy, sure) and is instead willing to share Lena with them and simply be happy that she's willing to spend time with her at all.

dontcarewhateverno said:

"Bro. She must be cheating on him with Steve. He's messed around with Lisa and get this... she says he's got a girlfriend. Case proven, motherfucker!"

Real life, in a group of 13 friends/aquaintances or any logical screenplay:
'Dude. Wtf are you talking about? You realize the world consists of more than just our 13 person friend-group?'
"Yeah. Uh.. Sorry Bro. Just high."

ORS logic or average sitcom doing fan-service:
'Checks out, bro. Tha's craazy!!'
"I kno rite?!?"

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You forgot the punchline:

"Hey bros, throw me a beer, i just broke up with my girl. Turns out she was cheating on me with Steve, that cheap slut."

"Lena will be able to sport 3 different bikinis in the next updates. The designs are done, but I still haven't decided on the color schemes"

It seems we are getting more than one option for Lena's bikini, which is what me and others was hoping. I guess we haven't seen the most lewd option yet

The topless option better be in, in the best spirit of GGGB.

graneloso said:

We need more Holly in the game

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I'm kinda wishing for a sidestory with Holly as the protagonist dropping her inhibitions and getting wild (but not too wild, she still has to remain the sweet nerdy girl)

How can I get open relationship with Lena? How can I get Holly Ivy Lena threesome?

BloodyMares said:

I

And the cherry on top is, you don't know to what extent Lena was telling the truth in her story or if she altered some details to intentionally make it more kinky (or conversely downplayed it if Ian isn't into it as much) or she did those things with someone else. So, it could just be her fantasy that never happened in reality or she was in fact even wilder in her younger days. We can never know for certain because Lena never references this story in her POV.

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I kinda see that cuz in Lena and Ian love route or Chad Ian route she says she didn't piss on the prof. But in cuck/beta ian route she says she did it once, and it was awkward.

dobzzz said:

I kinda see that cuz in Lena and Ian love route or Chad Ian route she says she didn't piss on the prof. But in cuck/beta ian route she says she did it once, and it was awkward.

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Another thought and fitting in with the red string idea or at least the butterfly effect, do the choices made by the players effect that character's and other characters' past. Does an Ian who is on the love path cause Lena to have a slightly different past than the Lena when Ian is on the cuck path? Obviously this would hold true for the characters themselves so a slutty Lena would have a different past than a love route Lena or a Lena who agrees to let Seymour take pics of her has a slightly different past than the Lena who refuses him?

0tt0von said:

Another thought and fitting in with the red string idea or at least the butterfly effect, do the choices made by the players effect that character's and other characters' past. Does an Ian who is on the love path cause Lena to have a slightly different past than the Lena when Ian is on the cuck path? Obviously this would hold true for the characters themselves so a slutty Lena would have a different past than a love route Lena or a Lena who agrees to let Seymour take pics of her has a slightly different past than the Lena who refuses him?

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Yeah we see this with good Jess and bad Jess. So either Lena is embellishing her sexual exploits or Ian and Lena's current choices shape their past.

TBH I prefer the latter. The former kinda makes the story not move in a linear fashion and robs the story of the idea that we take these characters and transform them with our choices. Instead it becomes we choose their futures, but also their past. So no two playthroughs are starting from the same place. Fundamentally the two Lena's with different stories have different past meaning that at the start of the game we are playing different Lena's.

fatpussy123 said:

Yeah we see this with good Jess and bad Jess. So either Lena is embellishing her sexual exploits or Ian and Lena's current choices shape their past.

TBH I prefer the latter. The former kinda makes the story not move in a linear fashion and robs the story of the idea that we take these characters and transform them with our choices. Instead it becomes we choose their futures, but also their past. So no two playthroughs are starting from the same place. Fundamentally the two Lena's with different stories have different past meaning that at the start of the game we are playing different Lena's.

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It could be looked at one of two ways either the choices a player makes reverberates both forward and backward in time for the character or all choice is an illusion and a particular past means that the character will always take a particular path forward. I'm pretty sure a deep philosophical discussion on the nature of free will is the point of the game so Eva should be happy.

What do Lena's bikini designs look like?

BloodyMares said:

Interesting. "My boyfriend is so good and he's hanging out with different hot girls all the time that I feel inferior to. What should I do? Maybe dress in a different way? Try something new in bed? Try watching some porn to get new ideas to spice it up? Have more romantic dates to make him see that I'll never hurt him? No, cheating sounds like the best option. Once I'm slutty and experienced enough, no way he'll look at other girls!"

I'm not really an expert in psychology, and while technically there have been cases like these, in order for that to be possible, Holly's insecurity would need to be way stronger than her love for Ian. Because cheating on your boyfriend, who is still struggling after his last heartbreak, seems like a sure way to end that relationship in the dumbest way possible. Even if she may feel insecure intimately, I believe she doesn't think that cheating is something a loving girlfriend should do. And Holly may be gullible, but she's not stupid and can see several steps ahead. After all, she orchestrated the whole "Oh no, my room has only one bed so we'll have to sleep together" move. And on top of it, she's an avid reader. I imagine she read countless romance stories (good ones) and knows the most common relationship-ending factors like cheating, jealousy, lack of communication, etc.

If anything, if she's indeed this insecure, I think it would make her open to share Ian with other girls instead so he'd feel sexually satisfied with them and emotionally satisfied with her. You can already see this in the way she treats her relationship with Lena. When she learns about Louise or Ivy being side-hoes, she doesn't feel jealous (inferior to Ivy, sure) and is instead willing to share Lena with them and simply be happy that she's willing to spend time with her at all.

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Go outside, throw a rock into a crowd, and you'll probably find any number of people who's insecurities are stronger than their love for their partner. You'll probably also hit any number of people who have also reasoned themselves into doing the dumbest things possible. A lot of relationships end from self-sabotage, whether intentional or unintentional, and it certainly wouldn't be the first time that someone inexperienced and insecure fell into the wrong crowd, took the wrong advice and ended up making a mistake.

Because sure, it could push her towards the sharing route, but that's not the only reaction that an insecure person could possibly have. And to be clear, I didn't suggest that this was something she should come up with on her own, but something that should be influenced by corrupting Holly through a slutty Lena and Ivy. Like I said above, wrong crowd, bad advice. No matter how many books she's read, she doesn't have the real life experience to back it up and Ivy and Lena clearly have a lot of experience. It's not hard to fall into the mind trap of thinking they might know more about this than she does, even if they're corrupting her for their own enjoyment, rather than thinking of her or Ian's well-being.

If Holly is going to be this mary sue character who can do no wrong, who always makes good decisions, even if she's surrounded herself with people making bad decisions and trying to influence her, that's boring and not realistic either. Having a boyfriend shouldn't make her suddenly impervious to manipulation and corruption.

But I've already made my peace with the fact that it was a glitch and it's not a path that Eva seems to want to explore. It's disappointing because it's an interesting way to add corruption and have the decisions of the player on both Ian and Lena's paths come together to have an effect, but it is what it is, and there's plenty of other paths in the game that I'll enjoy with or without it.

fatpussy123 said:

Yeah we see this with good Jess and bad Jess. So either Lena is embellishing her sexual exploits or Ian and Lena's current choices shape their past.

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Yes! this was exactly what struck in my mind (Dream sequence Good/Bad Jess). Also notice how story changes(Jess's boyfriend/girlfriend) according to Lena's decision about working with Seymour.

I really liked this kinda story progression. This alone shows us how EK thinks about her story and characters and how diverse her writing is.

JoeSte91 said:

If Holly is going to be this mary sue character who can do no wrong, who always makes good decisions, even if she's surrounded herself with people making bad decisions and trying to influence her, that's boring and not realistic either.

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It's hardly the case. Holly can currently have a crush on an absolute piece of shit of a guy, to the point she invites him on a trip with her, lets him fuck her three ways to Sunday, then gets dumped the next morning without even as much as a thank you. It'd be a tall order to paint that as a good decision.

Holly can also be in exclusive relationship with a pretty great guy, and still lust after her friend to the point of getting romantic with her and confusing the hell out of herself over what it is that she really wants. Again, hardly good move making.

ffive said:

It's hardly the case. Holly can currently have a crush on an absolute piece of shit of a guy, to the point she invites him on a trip with him, lets him fuck her three ways to Sunday, then gets dumped the next morning without even as much as a thank you. It'd be a tall order to paint that as a good decision.

Holly can also be in exclusive relationship with a pretty great guy, and still lust after her friend to the point of getting romantic with her and confusing the hell out of herself over what it is that she really wants. Again, hardly good move making.

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Well, I was talking about the route where Ian is good to her, and Lena is manipulative. What I'm trying to say is that in that path, it doesn't seem like Lena/the player is able to have any influence over her. That's why I included the latter line in the paragraph

Having a boyfriend shouldn't make her suddenly impervious to manipulation and corruption.

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-Ian can be a dick to her, retroactively making her crush and decision to sleep with him a bad decision.
-Ian and Lena can be romantic to her, leading to the sharing path.
-Ian can also be solely romantic to her.
-Lena can be friendly to her without being romantic.

However, on a path of Ian being good to her, and Lena being slutty/manipulative, Holly seems to default to the Ian solo romantic path. If you follow that story with those decision factors, I think she ends up looking kind of faultless and it's a boring route to play, since Ivy and Lena's influence seems restricted, when having a insecure girl take bad advice from friends isn't a huge leap for the story to realistically take.

I get that it'd be more work but it seems like a natural fit for the game, given the dual perspectives, and factoring in the different player choices. It's just something I would have liked to see included in the story progression, but like I said, I accept that it's not happening.

0tt0von said:

It could be looked at one of two ways either the choices a player makes reverberates both forward and backward in time for the character or all choice is an illusion and a particular past means that the character will always take a particular path forward. I'm pretty sure a deep philosophical discussion on the nature of free will is the point of the game so Eva should be happy.

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This sounds like something either Ian will hallucinate about when doing drugs, or Seymour will have a pompous quasi-intellectual monologue about while he's trying to get Lena to orgasm using his collection of sex toys